The secular understanding is that we are emergents of the natural order and can be reduced to its elements. The theistic understanding is that we are emergents of the breath and will of God and can be reduced to those two elements, spirit and intent. When we consider that the natural order and God are the same, both and each an emerging process, the secular and the theistic are saying the same thing in different languages. The trap each can fall into is a subject-object split in which "the natural order" and "God" are seen as "out there." They both turn into religions at that point. Each defends its turf and rants and raves.
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